UK Wolf conservation reading

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9 years 1 week ago #26293 by Trowsahound
Trowsahound replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Tigers kill people dont they? But I dont think anyone would argue against trying to keep them in the wild. Same with Lions etc in Africa, and they kill livestock quite frequently. Its all about trying to strike a balance isnt it? In the case of those animals terrific progress has been made to educate local people and share income from tourism that is generated by them, the world would be a poorer place without all of these beautiful creatures.

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9 years 1 week ago #26297 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Trowsahound wrote:

Tigers kill people dont they? But I dont think anyone would argue against trying to keep them in the wild. Same with Lions etc in Africa, and they kill livestock quite frequently. Its all about trying to strike a balance isnt it? In the case of those animals terrific progress has been made to educate local people and share income from tourism that is generated by them, the world would be a poorer place without all of these beautiful creatures.


Sorry but I am from a farming family,and surely we have rights too?
I dont have a problem with these creatures,as long as they are contained in a suitable area...I have no problem killing Foxes that take stock,Mink that destroy wildlife,or Deer that consume crops..in fact I spend a lot of my time doing it,on our farm and others..and even get paid for doing it.. :)
As for Tigers,ones that kill people are destroyed,I'm sure,under licence from the government.. ;)

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9 years 6 days ago #26299 by Robb
Robb replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Problem is that there's no wild left for them as farmers have taken it from wild-life. Agreed you may get the occasional man-killer and these have always been hunted and killed. Most incidents with people are bacause there habitat has been taken and there's no where else to find food but on the farm lands.

If the attitude of farmers continues un-abated as it has for the last 50 years or so there will be no wild-life left to the regret of most of the population, even if not HB's.

Rob B

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9 years 6 days ago #26306 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
The truth as I see it is that the population of this country has expanded to unsustainable levels..the wilds have been taken to provide food for the populace..and roads have been allowed to spread across too much of our country...there are wilds left,but only in Scotland and parts of Wales...not enough to sustain the tracts needed for such a specialized beasty...
Come and see the huge amounts of deer and rabbits we have in Scotland...and then tell me there is no food left...but space..thats another matter..

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9 years 6 days ago - 9 years 6 days ago #26307 by Robb
Robb replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
hairybeasty wrote:

The truth as I see it is that the population of this country has expanded to unsustainable levels..the wilds have been taken to provide food for the populace..and roads have been allowed to spread across too much of our country...there are wilds left,but only in Scotland and parts of Wales...not enough to sustain the tracts needed for such a specialized beasty...
Come and see the huge amounts of deer and rabbits we have in Scotland...and then tell me there is no food left...but space..thats another matter..


HB you speak sense at last. Things cannot remain unstainable for ever and when things change the Wolf will return.

The large numbers of Deer have ruined the Scottish environment, Scotland needs an Apex Predator for the environments sake.

Rob B
Last Edit: 9 years 6 days ago by Robb.

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9 years 6 days ago #26316 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Robb wrote:
[/quote]
HB you speak sense at last. Things cannot remain unstainable for ever and when things change the Wolf will return.

The large numbers of Deer have ruined the Scottish environment, Scotland needs an Apex Predator for the environments sake.[/quote]

Oh you naughty revolutionary you!! ;)
Maybe we should introduce some Bears or Snakes to thin out the people a bit.. :)

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9 years 6 days ago #26317 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
BTW Jane,great video's,will have to watch properly when time allows...just one thing strikes me at the moment...that bloke is a nutter!!! :laugh:

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9 years 6 days ago #26320 by Trowsahound
Trowsahound replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
I agree, most of the world's problems can in my opinion, be attributed to over population of humans at the end of the day. The trouble with trying to 'contain' these animals surely is that then the area of containment becomes a kind of theme park, and then there's no apparent reason for saving the surrounding areas of wilderness. I believe that elephants in Africa were used to roaming for hundreds of miles but since the formation of unnatural 'reserves', are confined to them now - their instinct still tells them to migrate to other areas, where they meet roads and villages, cause damage and are shot. We need to preserve the animals to preserve the wilderness and vice versa I reckon...

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9 years 6 days ago #26325 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Not a wolf related thing I know,but the Scottish Wildcat will be central in the preservation of the wilds of scotland..there are less than 400 of them left in the world,and must be one of the world's most endangered species...on an up note,the first wildcat kitten to be born in captivity has arrived in a reserve in scotland this month... :)

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9 years 6 days ago #26328 by Robb
Robb replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Trowsahound wrote:

I agree, most of the world's problems can in my opinion, be attributed to over population of humans at the end of the day. The trouble with trying to 'contain' these animals surely is that then the area of containment becomes a kind of theme park, and then there's no apparent reason for saving the surrounding areas of wilderness. I believe that elephants in Africa were used to roaming for hundreds of miles but since the formation of unnatural 'reserves', are confined to them now - their instinct still tells them to migrate to other areas, where they meet roads and villages, cause damage and are shot. We need to preserve the animals to preserve the wilderness and vice versa I reckon...


If we'd paid more attention to the needs of the world's wildlife decades ago and population growth had been contained then we wouldn't have all the environmental and global warming problems that we have today.

Rob B

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9 years 6 days ago #26330 by Joerg Yoki
Joerg Yoki replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Hello,

I have in my little library, the book "Decade of the Wolf - Returning the Wild to Yellowstone" from Douglas Smith and Gary Ferguson.



Wolf biologist D.Smith and nature writer G.Ferguson deliver a compelling inside look at the Yellowstone Wolf Recovery Project, covering the 10 years that have passed since the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service made the controversial decision to reintroduce wolves into the national park.

I think this experiences can help, by a return-project in Scotland.

Best regards
Joerg and Yoki dh:)
Attachments:

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9 years 5 days ago #26384 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
hairybeasty wrote:

Not a wolf related thing I know,but the Scottish Wildcat will be central in the preservation of the wilds of scotland..there are less than 400 of them left in the world,and must be one of the world's most endangered species...on an up note,the first wildcat kitten to be born in captivity has arrived in a reserve in scotland this month... :)


Actually just found out I am talking out the wrong end..there have been lots of kittens born in captivity...from about 2005 onwards.. :blush:

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9 years 5 days ago #26385 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Robb wrote:[/quote]

If we'd paid more attention to the needs of the world's wildlife decades ago and population growth had been contained then we wouldn't have all the environmental and global warming problems that we have today.[/quote]

And maybe we would still be living in the Dark Ages too..

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9 years 5 days ago #26397 by Robb
Robb replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
If the alarmists are right and I hope they're not then we will be living in the dark ages again soon. You said yourself that current trends aren't sustainable.

Rob B

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9 years 5 days ago #26398 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
True..the population boom might be directly linked to the increase in living standards and medical advances...both of which are set for problems..not just from the recession,but also from the Green Agenda..

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9 years 5 days ago #26404 by verenav
verenav replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
sorry , wasn't on in a while - yep , " never cry wolve" is after that book ( which I haven't read ) , - always loved wolves from early childhood on ( and cheetahs , no wonder I end up with sighthounds ) - watched and read a lot about them , this film is by far my favourite - combining story telling , information , great/wicked humor and incredibly beautiful pictures into one -

V.

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9 years 5 days ago #26405 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Trowsahound wrote:

Tigers kill people dont they? But I dont think anyone would argue against trying to keep them in the wild. Same with Lions etc in Africa, and they kill livestock quite frequently. Its all about trying to strike a balance isnt it? In the case of those animals terrific progress has been made to educate local people and share income from tourism that is generated by them, the world would be a poorer place without all of these beautiful creatures.


A quick quote from "The Field" magazine,June 2005 about the greatest man-eaters of recorded history..."in 1898,a Royal Engineers officer,John Patterson,was charged with driving a railway..from Mombasa ..Kenya..to Uganda..At the Tsavo river,the march of Empire was halted when two man-eating lions killed 140 labourers shipped in from India,plus uncounted africans...Patterson eventually shot both beasts...

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9 years 5 days ago #26407 by Trowsahound
Trowsahound replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Yes they shoot rogue tigers that kill people also, and I dont personally have a problem with shooting dangerous individual animals! (They say that when they've done it once they will do it again.) But I believe tigers should still be allowed to live in their natural environment (and wolves!). A lot of the pressures these creatures find themselves under these days are the fault of humankind, we created the problem and since we're apparently in charge, we should find a solution, difficult though it undoubtedly is!

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9 years 3 days ago #26483 by Joerg Yoki
Joerg Yoki replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
verenav wrote:

sorry , wasn't on in a while - yep , " never cry wolve" is after that book ( which I haven't read ) , - always loved wolves from early childhood on ( and cheetahs , no wonder I end up with sighthounds ) - watched and read a lot about them , this film is by far my favourite - combining story telling , information , great/wicked humor and incredibly beautiful pictures into one -

V.


Hello Verena,

Thanks for your informations.

Here are links to 2 German Wolf forums. I think you can German(?).

Forum over the Lausitz wolves: lausitz-wolf.foren-city.de/

Forum over wolves international (many USA)in German: www.wolfswelten.de/forum_neu/index.php

Regards
Joerg and Yoki dh:)

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9 years 1 day ago #26557 by hairybeasty
hairybeasty replied the topic: Re:UK Wolf conservation reading
Trowsahound wrote:

Yes they shoot rogue tigers that kill people also, and I dont personally have a problem with shooting dangerous individual animals! (They say that when they've done it once they will do it again.) But I believe tigers should still be allowed to live in their natural environment (and wolves!). A lot of the pressures these creatures find themselves under these days are the fault of humankind, we created the problem and since we're apparently in charge, we should find a solution, difficult though it undoubtedly is!


Oh..how true that all is...but what a balancing act...things have changed beyond all recognition since the wolf was exterminated from our shores...some things for the better..but most not...the question I put is..."what is the most sensible way to re-introduce them,giving the least friction between species,but yet allowing both the freedom that they both deserve?"

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