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TOPIC: Things your vet might not know

Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32873

Cross posted with Allyn's kind permission from the US Deerhound List. Please note that all terms are in American - UK names might vary slightly.


Scottish Deerhounds as a breed have some medical idiosyncracies that owners and their vets should be aware of. These are not necessarily meant to indicate pathology (though some are serious conditions), but to be mostly precautionary and illuminating. Further information is available on the Scottish Deerhound Club of America website (www.deerhound.org), and greyhound/sighthound information is available on www.greyhoundgang.org.

The most important issue is the sighthound's sensitivity to barbituate anesthetics. Many sighthounds have died after the use of these; probably because it is taken up in fat, and with the sighthound's lower percentage of fat, this leaves more to go to the brain and other organs. Most vets no longer use barbituates for anesthesia, but double checking anesthetic protocol with the vet before any procedure is OK'd is recommended; and a "NO BARBITUATES" alert should be on the dog's medical record.

Deerhounds also tend to go down and wake up "hard" from many anesthetics, and should be carefully monitored until fully conscious. They are sensitive to anesthetics in general, and using just the amount needed to attain adequate unconsciousness is recommended. For many minor procedures a light sedative and local anesthetic are sometimes sufficient; and this option should be explored with your vet.

Deerhounds can also be highly sensitive to sulfa antibiotics, especially with prolonged or repeat dosings of it. Many will develop an autoimmune thrombocytopenia (decreased platelets) or leukopenia (decreased white blood cells) from it; In a few cases this has proved fatal, though cessation of the drug usually reverses the symptoms; the giving of steroids for their immunosuppressive action has sometimes been necessary. Sulfa antibiotics are useful for a number of conditions, and most dogs handle them OK, but not many Deerhounds. They are marketed under a variety of brand names, so always check that you are not being prescribed a sulfa; and "NO SULFAS" should also be on the dogs's medical record.

Deerhound females have passed away after spays and other abdominal surgeries, due to bleeding out, more than is average for dogs in general. Factor VII bleeding disorder has been identified in the breed, There is a genetic test for this disorder, and many breeders are breeding so as not to produce affected puppies. Even normal Factor VII females have died, however, after these surgeries, so this is not the full answer to the problem. It is recommended when spaying that a long abdominal incision be made, so that there is full surgical access to the area, and ligation of severed structures can be completely and adequately done.

Rimadyl has caused sometimes fatal liver reactions in Deerhounds- adverse reactions have also been reported with Tagamet, phenylbutazone, and chloramphenicol. Cephalexin type antibiotics can sometimes cause inappetance in Deerhounds, though they are usually not seriously sensitive to them otherwise. Giving with food can help, and other better tolerated drugs might be chosen instead. Amoxicillins and Baytril are often well tolerated and provide broad spectrum protection.

Deerhounds will sometimes pine while in hospital, and may not eat. Some vets prefer to keep an animal in hospital until they start to eat; but this may not be the best choice for sensitive Deerhounds, and sending them home to see if they start eating there sometimes works out better.

Deerhounds tend to have low normal temperatures at rest, so even what would be considered just a moderate fever in another breed might signal a more significant fever in a Deerhound.

Deerhounds and other sighthounds tend to have large hearts compared to other breeds. These have sometimes been mistakenly identified as pathologically enlarged. Their heartrate is typically low at rest. If there is a question about a Deerhound's heart condition, consultation with a veterinary cardiologist familiar with sighthound heart characteristics is recommended.

Deerhounds have marked sinus arrhythmia, which means that their heart speeds up when they breathe in, and slows down when they're breathing out. This change in heart rate sometimes alarms owners. If it is "regularly irregular" that is normal- it is the irregularly irregular heartbeat that signals a problem. All dogs have sinus arrhythmia, but in the dogs with slower heart rates it's more obvious.

Deerhounds tend to have low normal thyroid levels; and without symptoms of hypothyroidism treatment with thyroid supplementation is usually not indicated.

Additionally, Deerhounds tend to have high normal to somewhat high red blood cell counts. High RBCs in dogs in general can indicate dehydration; symptoms, or lack of them, have to be considered when interpreting RBC levels.

Cystinuria is a genetic condition that male Deerhounds can get, (so far we haven't found females with it, though they may be the ones to pass on the genes). In this the dogs do not metabolize cystine properly and it is shed into the urine; occasionally causing stones which can eventually plug the urinary passageways; though many cystinuric dogs never develop stones. Diet has not been found to be useful treatment for cystinuric stone prevention- corrective surgery, including cystotomy, perineal urethrostomy and often neutering, and ongoing careful monitoring of urinary output, are the current methods of management of this condition. There is an online cystinuria list that owners of cystinuric dogs, and other interested people, can join to stay abreast of developments, including the hoped for genetic test being worked on for Mastiffs, which may wind up being useful for Deerhounds as well. Urine testing for cystinuria is taking place at UPenn- be aware that a negative finding is not always reliable, as the shedding of cystine into the urine can be intermittent.

Vets and Deerhound owners should discuss bloat symptoms and emergency bloat protocol, and owners should know what to do after regular vet hours with a suspected bloat; as it often happens at night, and requires immediate veterinary, and usually surgical, intervention for the outcome to be a good one.

Persistent or worsening lameness in middle aged and older Deerhounds, whose families have instances of bone cancer, should have bone cancer included as a possible cause when diagnosing. Other athletic injuries Deerhounds are prone to are broken toes, cruciate ligament injuries, and sore (sometimes very persistently sore) necks, grumblingly referred to as "Deerhound neck".

Splenic torsion, Addison's disease, liver shunts, 'genetic' immunodeficiency respiratory illness, and Factor VII clotting disorder happen in Deerhounds in somewhat higher percentage than the average dog population, and should be considered where appropriate.

Again, there is information on most of these considerations on the Scottish Deerhound Club of America website (www.deerhound.org)

Written by: Allyn Babitch, Sindar Scottish Deerhounds and SkyHorse Curly Horses, San Jose, CA
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32878

Might be worth people looking at this as well - as it makes it easier to understand
if you ever have to have blood work done on your hound

www.greyhound-data.com/di..._Greyhounds.pdf
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32895

I think , that Allyn's essay is a " work in progress " currently - as she gets more information coming in , she does add to it - might be worthwhile updating every so often .....great info for sure - had something like this , but not as detailed , for the last few years with my dogs files at home /in my car/at my "main vets " , you never know when you might need it ( hopefully never of course ...).
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32905

With Allyn's permission, I intend to update as and when. She's currently gathering information on cephalexin.
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32911

Hello Sid,

Thanks for your important informations from yesterday.

I have me print this message for our vets and had gave a copy to Sylke for the Greyhounds.

Regards
Joerg and Yoki dh:)
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32927

Vets and Deerhound owners should discuss bloat symptoms and emergency bloat protocol, and owners should know what to do after regular vet hours with a suspected bloat; as it often happens at night, and requires immediate veterinary, and usually surgical, intervention for the outcome to be a good one.

Think this is what worry's me the most - the emergency vets we have to use,
is about 30 mins away, i do have zatic in stock, but its if i would be able to use it
and if it would help give me time if it ever happened.
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32932

I am not familiar with 'zatic' Chook - what is it please?
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32933

Bodhranlady wrote:
I am not familiar with 'zatic' Chook - what is it please?

Sorry spelt it wrong its zitac
its for the Symptomatic treatment for the reduction of vomiting associated with chronic gastritis in dogs,
it contains cimetidine.
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32970

And this has just come in on the List:

Hey all,

I was reminded by a UK vet that "Baytril should not be used on young
developing large breed dogs such as Deerhounds." Please add this to your
articles if you've gotten them.

Allyn

Edit: please add

Hello again all,

I was asked about the Baytril constraint in young Deerhounds. Here is what
is the Baytril pamphlet says in the side effects section:

"Also, due to potential joint and cartilage damage, it is often advised that
Baytril should not be used in the younger canine during their rapid growth
phase, approximately 2 to 8 months in small to medium dogs, 2 to 12 months
in larger dogs and 2 to 18 months in giant breeds." It doesn't say how the
drug affects the joints and cartilage to damage them in that section- that
information might be in the pharmacological small print.

Drugs are generally researchable online, so any questions about possible
side effects or constraints in any of them can often be looked up there. It
might be prudent to look up any drugs that are prescribed for your dog-
though as Ginni cautions us, the drug companies are obliged to print even
rare side effects, and all drugs have them; this does not negate their
usefulness in the vast majority of cases. Still, knowing what might happen
can alert us what to be on the lookout for in our sensitive Deerhounds.

Allyn

PS I'm going to add the 18 months of age minimum limit on the use of Baytril
in Deerhounds in the medical essay. One more thing! I'll post what I add.
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32971

i dont know if its the same for deerhounds, but Finn (deerhound x greyhound) had a horrible reaction to metacam, apartently quite common in hounds, pooing out blood, and totally spaced out not nice :(
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Re: Things your vet might not know 6 years 8 months ago #32973

Just to say Baytil should not be used on any young growing dog not just Deerhounds as it effects the platlets growth.
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